god with no religion?

[fudgecake]

i posted this thread about standing up for what i believe in and someone posts this. he has a good point. but can u tell me what i should tell him/.??


"Hmm how typically deceptive of Christians to come up with something like this.

Ultimately every religion believes in the same God and people who think otherwise are ignorant. Christianity only came about 2,000 years ago. Hinduism came about 8,000 years ago. That means the entire Old Testament is not Christian, but of course there's still God. The difference between the two these days is severe no thanks to idiots trying to socially control people through religion. But ultimately every religion comes down to 3 things that God wants us to follow.

1. Believe in God.
2. Don't bring harm to yourself.
3. Don't bring harm to others.

For me, following a religion just hindered life. The amount of rules these days that never even existed a few hundred years ago are just so ridiculous. Like if God actually tests us and sends people to hell that don't believe in Christianity, (basically everyone before Jesus and everyone not living in the tiny portion of the middle-east in the time Jesus came and Christianity started), well then God is just an #%$hole to his own creations. The God in Christianity these days isn't the same God in the Old Testament. In fact the image Christians give God makes him seem like a sick person... creating lives knowing perfectly well that he's just going to put most of them in endless torture when they die.

Yeah... I'd rather just follow God and not a religion."

[Bap]

Er... hopefully I'm allowed to post here, but I'm kinda confused by this guy's "follow God, but not religion" reasoning... xD; (So this isn't really answering your post, but I just wanted to add another question, if that's okay? xD;)

I don't understand how you can follow "God" but not follow "religion." @o@a

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/religion

Like... the Dictionary.com definition of "religion" is a set of beliefs, basically, right? xD; And, where do Christians get their beliefs? @o@a The Bible, right? D: And... since the whole Bible is "God-breathed" ( 2 Timothy 3:16 ) then that means by following the Bible (which is pretty much our beliefs, which in turn = religion [sorta. xD;] ) then wouldn't that mean by following "religion," we're following God? xD;

[RedMage]

This individual talks with great assurance about Christianity but obviously knows fairly little about actual Christian doctrine. It's certainly not the case that everyone who lived before Jesus went to hell - the Old Testament has many faithful people who believed in the true God and who are surely in heaven now. God wasn't just stringing, say, Abraham along. See the "hall of faith" passage in Hebrews.

The problem, of course, with the "I believe in God, but not an organized religion" philosophy is that "God" very quickly tends to become whatever you want him or it to be. C.S. Lewis wrote a brilliant section in Mere Christianity on this sort of "God," which he referred to as the "life-force" (as he had heard some people call it). This kind of "God" gives you the comfort of believing there's a higher power at work in the universe, and that everything in general and your life in particular isn't just a "meaningless dance of atoms," but lets you off the hook for any of the more tiresome, inconvenient parts of believing in a deity - you know, like changing your behavior to suit His laws.

Of course everybody is aware of the "golden rule" (don't harm yourself, don't harm others) in their hearts, and yet strangely everyone fails to adhere to this great statute. While all other religions (or non-religions, as this person would prefer) basically, as a bottom line, emphasize efforts to be a "good person" by more closely following this one great law, only Christianity offers an explanation for why nobody ever succeeds in those efforts as well as they'd like and offers an escape from the endless, futile toil.

But you'd probably be wasting your time trying to reason with this individual.

[Cap'n Nick]

I doubt this fellow would be responsive to anything you might say in return. Ignorant objections such as these (and I do mean ignorant, for the Christian answers to these questions are readily available to all who seek them) are usually the result of personal anger and resentment rather than reason and deliberation. The best answer you can give is to treat him nicely and let him see Christ in you.

For our own edification, however, it is good to remember that while the people of the Old Testament gave sacrifices as commanded by God, their salvation ultimately came from Jesus, just like ours*. Though there have been different prophets and different temples, the basis for God's relationship with man has always been the same.

In the same way, while virtually all people seek God, few find the same one. Even in the basic stipulations given to you there is infinite room for conflict. We are to "believe in God." Does this mean to acknowledge his existence or to place trust in him? If we trust him, do we trust him to preserve us or to do his own will regardless of our welfare or destruction? Similar questions arise when we consider harm to ourselves and others. What one person may consider harmful might be another's benefit. It could hardly be said that these requirements make all religions the same.

[Fish and Chips]

"Ultimately every religion believes in the same God."

I cannot tell you how sick I am of that argument. If we all believed in the same God, then we'd all believe the same thing, no inter-religion contradictions, unless God took some sort of sadistic pleasure in facing us all of against one another. If the God of Christianity is really also the Allah of Islam, then why does God purport Jesus as his son but Allah writes him off as just another prophet and turns to Mohammad? And that's not even taking into account Polytheistic religions. He mentioned Hinduism, they have around 3,000 gods and keep tacking on new ones when they come across them.

However...

I find myself between a rock and a hard place when it comes to discussing religion. Plenty of people, like the Pharisees, are just wrapped up in the letter of the law but not the spirit. More like they worship Christianity, not God. That, I can see, quiet possibly even agree with. But that's not the point he's making either.

Moving on...

God doesn't take sick satisfaction out of the loss of his children, he is saddened by it, because we chose to turn away from him. And continuing on that thought, I do believe God makes appropriations for certain people. If Jesus is God, who continually uses the word "We" in the Old Testament, then those people and prophets who predate Christianity are, in fact, saved, as they were worshipping Jesus all along. Christianity is Judaism 2.0, clarifying, fulfilling, and paying for the law that was already being practiced, though often for the wrong reasons at the time.

As for those who have never heard of Christianity and never will, I trust that God shall judge them on different terms. Seek and yee shall find, and so the man living in total isolation in the mountains or the jungle who wonders about where the universe and everything came from, he will find his answers if he's truly looking for them.

[uc pseudonym]

In an effort to avoid repeat a lot of what has been said, I'll try to take this from a different angle. I'm immensely cynical about debating serious subjects online, so I think the best thing to do is represent your faith in a solid and logical manner without getting caught up in rhetoric battles. But since you likely want to be able to post in response to him, I'll see what I can suggest.

The best tactic, in my hopefully humble opinion, is to confront the numerous misunderstandings of Christianity within the post. Chief among these are the idea that Christianity only traces its roots back 2000 years, that people in BC eras are all condemned to hell, and that Christianity boils down to only those three points (which could become a long argument). If you want to do more than defend, it might be fairly simple to point out that his own position is somewhat contradictory, saying that all religions follow the same God but later saying "The God in Christianity these days isn't the same God in the Old Testament." That strikes me as very much the same as how Christians feel about different ideas of God.

[Peanut]

Hmmm...well, it depends on how far you are willing to take this. If you just simply want to defend your position then I would recommend doing what UC suggested and try to stay as respectful to his position as possible. But, if you want to take this further, then I would suggest you go on the offensive and begin to attack the relatively weak points he raise. I would seriously recommend you avoid going on the offensive unless you feel that God wants you too since, as everyone else has already pointed out this guy probably won't change his opinion no matter how strong your argument is.

However, if this was me I probably would go on the offensive seeing as how...well...I can't really help myself...I would start by pointing out that the ultimate point of Christianity is a relationship with the Judeo-Christian God (that way he can't say that he's trying to do the same thing) and that the rules are there to help us not restrict us similar to how a parent might have a rule to keep a child away from something that might harm them. Also, you don't have to follow "the rules" to go to heaven, it's highly encouraged that you follow them but if you do slip up God isn't just waiting up there in heaven to smite you. I would also point out that he is completely wrong about the God of the Old Testament being different from the God of the New Testament by comparing the book of Judges to the story of the prodigal son. I would also point out that God doesn't really send people to hell, they choose it (in other words I would explain the concept of Free Will). Anyway, that's what I would do in this situation, it is by no means the best way to respond to him but...well...as I said, I can't help myself...