CAA: Christian Anime Alliance

American ignorance sometimes upsets me, now is one of those times. The other day I was reading an Archie comic from the library. I was reading an article and it said something like "we are releasing a line of Sabrina manga comics" First of all, it isnt even manga because it isnt a japanese comic, second of all, manga comics is repetitive since the defenition of manga is japanese comic. Have you guys noticed this kind of stuff before? If so, tell us your opinion on it.

Oh, I think fans always notice it. ^^

I don't pay any mind, because after all sometimes we repeat other things, and if you know what the person is talking about, why worry about it?

I know sometimes I slip and refer to things the wrong way. It's my tongue walking over itself. So I don't worry when other people do it.

And if it's just ignorance... again, who cares? People say "ATM machine" all the time, when the "M" already stands for "Machine."

I don't worry about stuff like this.

Alice wrote:People say "ATM machine" all the time, when the "M" already stands for "Machine."

I don't worry about stuff like this.

I do.

YOU'RE SAYING "AUTOMATIC TELLER MACHINE MACHINE!" IT SOUNDS FREAKIN' STUPID! STOP!

As an electrician, you see this too when people refer to it as "AC current" and "DC current" when the "C" already stands for "current."

Im not worried, i didnt mean to come off like that. It just irks me for some reason. And I do say ATM Machine, I guess Im guilty.

My father's sort of a strickler for correctly spoken English. But I'm like, "You know what I mean." I tend to save the correct English for when it matters, like in writing.

Sometimes I'm just glad to get (spoken) words out at all. That's probably why I don't care much about mistakes in terminology.

Alice wrote:My father's sort of a strickler for correctly spoken English. But I'm like, "You know what I mean." I tend to save the correct English for when it matters, like in writing.

Sometimes I'm just glad to get (spoken) words out at all. That's probably why I don't care much about mistakes in terminology.

Oh my word, my dad is a stickler for correct english as well. If we say like to much he'll get mad .

Mine just teases me about saying "like." I don't mind. He doesn't really either, he just doesn't want me sounding so much like a kid, I guess. ^^ Or something...

I might not mind incorrect terms, but I do notice spelling errors. I try not to let them bother me, but I do find them distracting.

And I'm always disconcerted when I find out I've misspelled something. Wish CAA had spell check.

Yah, a spellcheck on the CAA would be really nice. I'm not the greatest speller but I have been trying to spell things correctly lately.

I really don't see the big dealio.. I call Comics from Japan Manga all the time...and I draw Mangasque drawings...and I want to write American manga...

Manga only means comic book.. whoop dee doo..

and the japanese are always mispronouncing things with their "Engrish.." so it really shouldn't bother anyone..^^

I don't mind people saying "manga comic". It distinguishes from a "Marvel comic" or a "newspaper comic". Still, I usually just say "manga"

And I don't think manga has to only come from Japan, either. Sure, manga is the Japanese word for comic, but internationally it represents more a specific genre and style of comic originating in Japan.

If we're going to be technical, I could call any old comic a "manga," just as I could call my house "una casa," and it would be correct.

aren't the Japanese calling manga something else now? that's what I heard from...somewhere..

Just a personal request... can we not get into the "definition of manga" subject again? It has been discussed enough.

I suppose that "manga comics" is a redundant term, but I think that in the context of their use each word actually has a seperate meaning. In general I accept such things when they involve words from different languages, as not everyone reading will be familiar with the term "manga" and so the use of both terms provides greater clarity.

Though it doesn't annoy me, I find "ATM machine" silly, in addition to phrases like it.

uc pseudonym wrote:Just a personal request... can we not get into the "definition of manga" subject again? It has been discussed enough.

I suppose that "manga comics" is a redundant term, but I think that in the context of their use each word actually has a seperate meaning. In general I accept such things when they involve words from different languages, as not everyone reading will be familiar with the term "manga" and so the use of both terms provides greater clarity.

Though it doesn't annoy me, I find "ATM machine" silly, in addition to phrases like it.

Ok, no more talk about the definiton of manga...sorry.

Well. One kid at my school always calls it Japenese anime. I tell him that anime is Japanese animation, but no he insists on calling it japanese anime. Oh well.

Actually, I think "manga comics" is a pretty good term. If I hear "comics" I think of American comics like X-Men. If I hear "manga" I think of Japanese comics like the ones we discuss here. But if I hear "manga comics" I immediately think of American comics that utilize stylistic elements commonly found in manga, which happens to be exactly what these people are trying to describe. Is it redundant? Sure. But, it's both effective and concise, which is what communication is all about.

Cap'n wrote:Actually, I think "manga comics" is a pretty good term. If I hear "comics" I think of American comics like X-Men. If I hear "manga" I think of Japanese comics like the ones we discuss here. But if I hear "manga comics" I immediately think of American comics that utilize stylistic elements commonly found in manga, which happens to be exactly what these people are trying to describe. Is it redundant? Sure. But, it's both effective and concise, which is what communication is all about.

Wow, I wouldnt of thought of that...it makes sense.

I usually call comics from America "comics" or "Amerimanga", comics from Japan "manga", and comics from Korea "manhwa". *shrugs* Though I guess manga comics works for stuff from the U.S.

As long as they don't start calling Teen Titans and stuff "anime", I'm happy. (disclaimer: I have nothing against Teen Titans. XD Or Avatar the Last Airbender or whatever, but it's not anime so NYAH! =P)

The thing that bugs me most is my little brother. He is constantly refering to manga as "anime books." Osaka and I remind him every time he says this that it makes him sound like an ignorant 62 year old (no, not sixty-one, not sixty-three, sixty-two), and yet to no avail: He still can't seem to catch himself. But beyond that, another thing that bugs me is when people make a big deal about it being "backwards," according to our standards anyways. I'm always tempted to explode at the simpletons and tell them to move on to bigger things, who cares if you read a book from right to left or left to right or right to right or--. . . OK, I need to calm down now. But suffice it to say, some people just can't get over thinking that the way we do things is the only way to do things.
The other thing that annoys the heck out of me is that any time you tell someone that you collect manga, the first question they always ask is, "Yeah, but not the kind with, like, porn, right?" Why is it that everybody automatically asscosiates manga with porn? Yes, some does contain it, but some American films contain porn, some American books conjure mental images of porn, porn is in magazines, porn is on the internet, porn is in calendars, porn is everywhere-- and yet everybody automatically assumes that it's somehow worst in manga. It's just stoopid (and yeah, I spelled it like that on purpose. Don't really know why, just suddenly felt the urge. 'Nuff said.)

Yumie wrote:The other thing that annoys the heck out of me is that any time you tell someone that you collect manga, the first question they always ask is, "Yeah, but not the kind with, like, porn, right?" Why is it that everybody automatically asscosiates manga with porn?

It's just easier to generalize if you don't really know what you're talking about. Its easy to assume that just because one example of manga has a porn in it then all manga must have porn in it just like an atheist or non-Christian assumes that just because one Christian is a hypocritical moron then all Christians must be a hypocritical moron. Its easier to generalize than to investigate the truth.

Yumie wrote:another thing that bugs me is when people make a big deal about it being "backwards," according to our standards anyways. I'm always tempted to explode at the simpletons and tell them to move on to bigger things, who cares if you read a book from right to left or left to right or right to right or--. . .

Oh I HATE that with a passion. I always want to say "I'm sorry not all countries read like the U.S.A., because the U.S.A. is, of course, the only country that reads things the RIGHT way"

Oi...

Actually, I'm not really convinced that we shouldn't flip the manga when it's translated. Reversing the text direction while keeping the pictures the same creates a conflict in flow direction that the artist did not intend.

Actually a japanese person would probably call american comics manga as well just as they call ALL animation anime. Disney is anime, marvel is anime. The word anime itself comes from the french word anime which means animation. But even so, calling something manga comics is redundant.

On the point about pewople thinking that all christians must be hypocritical morons id like to say that everyone, christian or not is hypocritical to some degree the only exception being Jesus of course. Society itself is hypocritical. On one hand they say that it's normal to like porn and such and on the other society looks down on anyone who does.

And even if you show someone a hentai manga to show that cartoons arent just for kids they'll say "Oh the japanese make THAT stuff for their kids?" Americans are just stupid.

Kura Ookami wrote:Actually a japanese person would probably call american comics manga as well just as they call ALL animation anime. Disney is anime, marvel is anime. The word anime itself comes from the french word anime which means animation. But even so, calling something manga comics is redundant.

Do note, however, that we are not speaking Japanese. In English, the words "anime," "manga" and "comics" have a number of connotations that should not be ignored. "Manga" may be the same as "comics" in Japanese, but in the language we are actually speaking they are different.

This isn't a hard concept. Ordering pie according to the fashion is different from ordering it à la mode. Film noir is not the same as black film. And, to take an example from Japanese instead of French, a hibachi restaurant is not the same as a grill.

So, "manga" and "comics" are the same, yet they are different. If they are different words with different meanings, is "manga comics" really redundant? Not unless you expect the listener to interpret your sentence in a bizarre and arbitrary hybrid of two very different languages. As it stands I think it is a concise and effective way to describe what the speaker intended.

Considering I don't even say manga correctly (by choice, not by ignorance) I have no room to criticize anyone else.

Perhaps I'm a bit too broad with my vocab; I have called manga "comics" and I have called those American-made manga "manga". I wouldn't compare say, Fruits Basket to Spiderman because I think they are truly different species of comic, but saying comic doesn't get me into nearly the kind of trouble saying "main-ga" does. =P

One last thought--I don't mind calling the American made stuff manga because to me, manga is a style and therefore an artist from any country could pick it up. I've referred to a manhwa before, but I don't know enough about manhwa to really have an intelligent discussion on the subject.

Actually, I'm not really convinced that we shouldn't flip the manga when it's translated. Reversing the text direction while keeping the pictures the same creates a conflict in flow direction that the artist did not intend.

That's never bothered me. The majority of my manga is not flipped, though, and I'd really be disappointed it if it went to flipping.

I'd like to reiterate that the "manga = comics" discussion has been gone over many times before, and that it probably won't be terribly beneficial to do so again.

bigsleepj wrote:It's just easier to generalize if you don't really know what you're talking about. Its easy to assume that just because one example of manga has a porn in it then all manga must have porn in it just like an atheist or non-Christian assumes that just because one Christian is a hypocritical moron then all Christians must be a hypocritical moron. Its easier to generalize than to investigate the truth.

That is very true. Just for the sake of balance, I'll point out that some (I believe it would be fair to say many) manga fans generalize about American comics out of ignorance.

Kokoro Daisuke wrote:Oh I HATE that with a passion. I always want to say "I'm sorry not all countries read like the U.S.A., because the U.S.A. is, of course, the only country that reads things the RIGHT way"

It might not be necessary to say this, and I might be being belligerent, but obviously I chose to respond. Though I don't want to support ethnocentrism, the fact is that, though left to right is not the only way to read, it is the way that English reads. Manga that read from right to left in a language that goes the opposite direction are as backward as a comic in Japanese that was paneled left to right.

Not that there is anything wrong with backwards.

uc pseudonym wrote:It might not be necessary to say this, and I might be being belligerent, but obviously I chose to respond. Though I don't want to support ethnocentrism, the fact is that, though left to right is not the only way to read, it is the way that English reads. Manga that read from right to left in a language that goes the opposite direction are as backward as a comic in Japanese that was paneled left to right.

Not that there is anything wrong with backwards.

Oh no, I realize that entirely, UC. ^^; I'm sorry if my post seemed a little..."rawr", but I was thinking of the people who say stuff like "It's so STUPID that these comics are backwards" when I wrote that...stuff like that...gets my dander up a bit. XD; Just to clarify.

Whoa...these posts are getting way to complex for my feeble mind to comprehend.