The Anti-gun thread

[EireWolf]

*shows her bare arms again to lighten things up*

[Twilly Spree]

Thanks yes! I think it's funny anyway....well so does Eire. That makes three of us!

[Stephen]

I will admit...I was annoyed with these threads early on...as I belive they were started because of the whole anime can't talk issue. Which is a silly reason to start somthing...but it was started. At this point..after taking a breather myself over the whole situation...everyone needs to chill out. Nobody is impedeing free speech. No posts have been deleted. For the most part people have acted mature on this whole issue...and I really see no more need for these threads to be bumped with life. You hate guns. You love guns. You don't give a flying monkeys knee cap about guns. You fall into one of these groups. For us to sit around and fight with each other over government laws or laws of other nations vs some country in Europe...is really here nor there. We are Christians..and as such we should move on. Staying on this subject clearly only breads(Edit: I am leaving that typo cause its kinda funny...I meant Breeds) arguement and fighting. If you hate guns, more power to ya. If you love them...more power to ya. I am hoping everyone can just let this slide right into thread oblivion...to be remembered and laughed about later in the archives. Hopefully this is the end of this silly and pointless argument.

[MillyFan]

This is so silly and pointless.

[Straylight]

I will admit...I was annoyed with these threads early on...as I belive they were started because of the whole anime can't talk issue. Which is a silly reason to start somthing...but it was started. At this point..after taking a breather myself over the whole situation...everyone needs to chill out. Nobody is impedeing free speech. No posts have been deleted. For the most part people have acted mature on this whole issue...and I really see no more need for these threads to be bumped with life. You hate guns. You love guns. You don't give a flying monkeys knee cap about guns. You fall into one of these groups. For us to sit around and fight with each other over government laws or laws of other nations vs some country in Europe...is really here nor there. We are Christians..and as such we should move on. Staying on this subject clearly only breads(Edit: I am leaving that typo cause its kinda funny...I meant Breeds) arguement and fighting. If you hate guns, more power to ya. If you love them...more power to ya. I am hoping everyone can just let this slide right into thread oblivion...to be remembered and laughed about later in the archives. Hopefully this is the end of this silly and pointless argument.

I totally agree with you man.

[inkhana]

This is so silly and pointless.

Funny...I thought I heard an echo...

>See? I can bare arms, too!

ROFL!

Yup, I'm looking forward to this all blowing over. Good post Shatterheart...

[Icarus]

While I, too, wish that the brouhaha would end, I actually would like to see this thread continue. I'm intersted in were it will go.

[YesIExist]

I must admit, a gun would certainly be handy if an intruder was in the house. I wouldn't think twice; just BANG-BANG. If you're in a position where you are endangered by another human being (or even an animal), I think a gun would probably be the most efficient and effective way to defend yourself.

[Straylight]

If an intruder was in my house and I was armed, I would not be able to bring myself to the point of killing another human - in doing so I have almost certainly sent someone to hell. I wouldn't want that hanging over my entire life.

It's possible (although dangerous) to fire disabling shots or point the gun and threaten, however this is risky because the criminal has probably got a gun himself.

As far as killing is concerned, I suppose the real question is "what would jesus do?"

[Stephen]

I think it comes down to a similar thing with war. If a Christian is in the army and kill an enemy solider, has he sinned? I don't recall men in the Bible being called sinners for doing that. If someone broke into my house and had a gun...I would want my family safe. Also with the legal system in America if you do not kill the person and you do indeed wound them...they will sue you for everything you have. Its been done before.

[YesIExist]

I believe that a person wants to break into my house for the sake of robbing or harming me or my loved ones. If they just intend to rob, but are surprised, an intruder may decide to kill whoever surprised them. Merely disabling a person with a gunshot may be sufficient. Still, when you're actually in a situation like that, it's really hard to tell what you might do.

When it comes down to it, choosing between myself and an intruder, the other person will be the one biting the bullet--perhaps literally. Such a person may not even come to God at all. Of course, that's not impossible, but you can be assured that I will be looking out for my own interests--not this numbskull who is breaking into my home.

[Shinja]

killing is never somthing to take lightly, but if you arm your self you should be ready to use it without question, or the other will. i do not personally feel it is a sin, to kill, it is a sin to murder, but you have to remeber if some one is in your house they made the choice to put themselvs in the position of being shot. in my view its thier choice,

[YesIExist]

killing is never somthing to take lightly, but if you arm your self you should be ready to use it without question, or the other will. i do not personally feel it is a sin, to kill, it is a sin to murder, but you have to remeber if some one is in your house they made the choice to put themselvs in the position of being shot. in my view its thier choice,

Yup

[The Grammarian]

C.S. Lewis' essay in The Weight of Glory on "Why I Am Not A Pacifist" is a good read on the Christian responsibility to self-defense, as is Dietrich Bonhoeffer's The Cost of Discipleship (which addresses it in several of its chapters).

[Bobtheduck]

I'm not so much into "self defense" as I'm into "defense of others" which applies to this as well as my views on war. Protection of others, and ultimately, the laying down of your life for others, that's the highest love you can have.

[Straylight]

I'm not so much into "self defense" as I'm into "defense of others" which applies to this as well as my views on war. Protection of others, and ultimately, the laying down of your life for others, that's the highest love you can have.

You bring up an extremely valid point. If there were other people in the house during the intruder situation, I think I'd be more inclined to throw away my fear of killing.

[Twilly Spree]

I personally don't think I could do it. I can't even imagine doing it. It's completely beyond me.



But I guess it really doesn't matter because I'll never have a gun in my house.

[EireWolf]

But I guess it really doesn't matter because I'll never have a gun in my house.

... unless an intruder brings one in with him.

Sorry; I couldn't resist.

[Twilly Spree]

hahaha totally right! I don't mine Eire, it was darn funny!

[uc pseudonym]

I think I'm going to regret having anything to do with this thread. Certainly, I'm not going to present a full argument, to anyone here or to Lewis. Regardless, I have to comment about this.

I think it comes down to a similar thing with war. If a Christian is in the army and kill an enemy solider, has he sinned? I don't recall men in the Bible being called sinners for doing that.

When God is speaking about who is going to build his temple, he says that David's son Solomon will build it, not David, because David's hands are "stained with blood." These were not murders. These were deaths caused in war. These are even relatively God-sanctioned battles. Does God say this is sinning? Not really. However, I think it does say something about His view on the subject.

[madphilb]

When God is speaking about who is going to build his temple, he says that David's son Solomon will build it, not David, because David's hands are "stained with blood." These were not murders. These were deaths caused in war. These are even relatively God-sanctioned battles. Does God say this is sinning? Not really. However, I think it does say something about His view on the subject.

Hmmm.... I always attributed that to his sending Bathsheba's husband, Uriah, off to be killed in battle.... but maybe I'm filtering the idea through my own bias, I can't say that I've studied this in detail recently.

[uc pseudonym]

This was my first consideration as well. However, with some study it is not the position I ended up in. Note that I say "some study" and not "extensive study," meaning that I do not claim a full understand of the passage. Also, it isn't that important to me, so I will probably not make the effort to do any of said study.

[EireWolf]

I'm with madphilb about the David=murderer thing... David specifically sent Bathsheba's husband to the front lines of battle, so that he would be killed and David could have Bathsheba.

[Fsiphskilm]

Oh my Gosh, you guys

[Minawa]

I believe that a person wants to break into my house for the sake of robbing or harming me or my loved ones. If they just intend to rob, but are surprised, an intruder may decide to kill whoever surprised them. Merely disabling a person with a gunshot may be sufficient. Still, when you're actually in a situation like that, it's really hard to tell what you might do.

When it comes down to it, choosing between myself and an intruder, the other person will be the one biting the bullet--perhaps literally. Such a person may not even come to God at all. Of course, that's not impossible, but you can be assured that I will be looking out for my own interests--not this numbskull who is breaking into my home.

If an unchristian intruder breaks into my house and kills me, I will go to heaven.

If I kill an unchristan intruder, they will have no chance to ever find God, and they will go to hell.

It is for sure that one day I will die, but who is to say if they will ever find God?

Thats all I'm going to say on this subject.

[Saint Kevin]

That's fine Minawa, and that would take true courage to face death unflinchingly like that, but, I think my reason for ever owning a gun would be the defense of those I love (many of whom are not Christians yet). In that respect, I agree with your stance (if I were to find myself alone, I could take care of myself and hopefully disable any attacker without needing a gun to do so, or, die trying).
On the defense of others thing, I agree with Bob though.

Anyways, back to the reason I was making this post...

I agree with you ninja, I am anti-gun. I don't like guns, period. I do believe that in some respects they are a necessary evil though (for reasons better discussed in another thread), and even though I detest guns, I plan on having one for the protection of my family. I am not totally unflinching on this issue, however, if my future wife does not want me to have a gun, and I can't persuade her otherwise, I'm just going to have to compromise. I don't mind, it's not like it's a life or death issue (maybe).

Cool avatar ninja. Do they even show that on tv any more, that's one of my fav cartoons.

[Twilly Spree]

Unfortunately no, but I have them all avi formatted on my mac. Ahh so good. Thanks by the way!

[Michael]

Check this out. Pay attention to these guys, they debate for fun.

http://homeschooldebate.com/phorum/viewtopic.php?t=4622

[Inferno]

how can you hate guns? if you use them right(like for hunting) they're really cool! this thread should be closed!

[uc pseudonym]

Zen... posting like that in such a volatile topic isn't really helpful. I will answer, but I would ask no one else too (unless a mod has something to say).

If this thread is closed, it will not be for that fact.

Now I'll answer your question: people can not like guns because they feel that they violate their Christian principles. You know, little things like that.